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	<title>Rich Sharples&#039; Blog &#187; IcedTea</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blog.softwhere.org/tag/icedtea/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blog.softwhere.org</link>
	<description>Musings on the world of software from the sharp end of the long tail</description>
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		<title>OpenJDK and Red Hat</title>
		<link>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/939</link>
		<comments>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/939#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 11:40:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>sharps</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IcedTea]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[java]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[OpenJDK]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Red Hat]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.softwhere.org/?p=939</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here&#8217;s an interview I did for DZone a while back about Red Hat&#8217;s involvement with OpenJDK. Some additional useful links : OpenJDK project IcedTea project IcedTea history Gary Benson&#8217;s Blog Andrew Hughes&#8217; Blog Andrew Haley&#8217;s Blog Lillian Angel&#8217;s Blog Mark Wielaard&#8217;s Blog]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s an interview I did for <a href="http://java.dzone.com/videos/tech-chat-rich-sharples">DZone</a> a while back about Red Hat&#8217;s involvement with OpenJDK.</p>
<p><embed src="http://blip.tv/play/5hyBkt8tAg" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="480" height="390" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed> </p>
<p>Some additional useful links :</p>
<p><a href="http://openjdk.java.net/">OpenJDK project</a><br />
<a href="http://iced-tea.org/wiki/Main_Page">IcedTea project</a><br />
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icedtea#History">IcedTea history</a><br />
<a href="http://gbenson.net/">Gary Benson&#8217;s Blog</a><br />
<a href="http://blog.fuseyism.com/">Andrew Hughes&#8217; Blog</a><br />
<a href="http://www.advogato.org/person/aph/">Andrew Haley&#8217;s Blog</a><br />
<a href="http://langel.wordpress.com/">Lillian Angel&#8217;s Blog</a><br />
<a href="http://gnu.wildebeest.org/diary/">Mark Wielaard&#8217;s Blog</a></p>
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		<title>Java is free at last. Now what ?</title>
		<link>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/209</link>
		<comments>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/209#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 02:19:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>sharps</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Technology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Fedora]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IcedTea]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[java]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[linux]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[OpenJDK]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.softwhere.org/?p=209</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Neil McAllister over at InfoWorld has what starts like a doom and gloom piece on the demise of Java. Having seen this kind of sensationalist drivel too often I was inclined to ignore it (and the ensuing thread on /.). I&#8217;m glad I didn&#8217;t i &#8211; Neil makes some good points and presents them well. [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil McAllister over at InfoWorld has what starts like a <a href="http://weblog.infoworld.com/fatalexception/archives/2008/06/java_is_free_at.html">doom and gloom piece</a> on the demise of Java. Having seen this kind of sensationalist drivel too often I was inclined to ignore it (and the ensuing thread on /.). I&#8217;m glad I didn&#8217;t i &#8211; Neil makes some good points and presents them well. The piece rises well above the typical sensationalist rants we&#8217;re all used to.</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;"><em>&#8220;I wouldn&#8217;t be the first to argue that Sun missed the boat by not releasing Java under an open source license sooner. As Apache Project co-founder <strong><a href="http://www.infoworld.com/article/06/06/27/79685_HNsunopensourcejava_1.html">Brian Behlendorf said in 2006</a></strong>, &#8220;I think had they done it, they would have established Java further as the language of choice by so many more people.&#8221; </em></p>
<p>From my very, very minor involvement with the <a href="http://iced-tea.org/wiki/Main_Page">IcedTea</a> project and since <a href="http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/85">joining</a> Red Hat just a few months ago I&#8217;ve seen a very different attitude towards Java. I was previously of the opinion (bear in mind I worked for Sun for almost 9 years) that Java was already essentially free and open enough &#8211; and that actually making it Open Source wouldn&#8217;t really change anything. Java had already become incredibly popular without the advantages of Open Source. But I now think Java did miss a <strong>huge</strong> opportunity by not being part of the major upstream Linux ecosystems &#8211; such Fedora and Debian.</p>
<p>So it almost certainly would have made a big difference 3 or 4 years ago; the question is &#8211; will it make a difference now. I&#8217;m optimistic &#8211; but admittedly slightly biased having invested a large part of the last decade in promoting Java in one way or another. Here&#8217;s why I&#8217;m optimistic.</p>
<ol>
<li>Java is still young &#8211; I still talk to customers who are only just contemplating moving to Java; and I&#8217;m still pretty confident that the majority of Java developers are only now working their way through school and college.</li>
<li>The only real, mainstream alternative to Java is Microsoft&#8217;s .NET platform. And the future of that is somewhat predicated on the success of Vista and Vista isn&#8217;t looking too hot right now. OK, Ruby, PHP, Scala, Python all have their place &#8211; but  they are just languages and don&#8217;t really complete with the Java platform.</li>
<li>There&#8217;s a real opportunity for one of the Linux distros. to become *the* Java developer OS &#8211; right now I would guesss that Windows XP and OS/X account for most Java developers desktops &#8211; that just seems completely wrong to me given Microsoft&#8217;s and Apple&#8217;s disdain of Java.</li>
</ol>
<p>I feel pretty encouraged by the reaction to our <a href="http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/196">announcement</a> last week and I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if the next wave of innovation in Java came from the new communities who can now adopt it. I for one would love to see one of the major Linux distros like Fedora step up and become the developer OS for Java &#8211; and when I say Java; I don&#8217;t just mean the language &#8211; I mean the entire Java ecosystem.</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">
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		<title>Java is finally Free and Open &#8211; part 2</title>
		<link>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/199</link>
		<comments>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/199#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jun 2008 15:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>sharps</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[java]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IcedTea]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[OpenJDK]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Red Hat]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[sun]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.softwhere.org/?p=199</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#8217;m going to attempt to answer some of the comments that last week&#8217;s post received. Problem is &#8211; there were a lot of them &#8211; spread across Reddit, Slashdot, Digg, DZone (and again), InfoQ and the blogosphere. I clearly can&#8217;t reply to them all so I&#8217;ve grouped them and will answer generally. But first &#8211; [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to attempt to answer some of the comments that last week&#8217;s post received. Problem is &#8211; there were a lot of them &#8211; spread across <a href="http://www.reddit.com/info/6o2fo/comments/">Reddit</a>, <a href="http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/06/19/1754255">Slashdot</a>, <a href="http://digg.com/linux_unix/Java_is_finally_Free_and_Open_GPL_Compatible">Digg</a>, <a href="http://java.dzone.com/news/red-hats-icedtea-project-power">DZone</a> (<a href="http://java.dzone.com/news/suns-open-source-java-right-ar">and again)</a>, <a href="http://www.infoq.com/news/2008/06/icedtea_tck">InfoQ</a> and the blogosphere. I clearly can&#8217;t reply to them all so I&#8217;ve grouped them and will answer generally.</p>
<p>But first &#8211; I&#8217;d like to make a point about Sun&#8217;s reaction. Opening Java was a big bold move &#8211; likely one of the biggest, boldest moves in our industry&#8217;s history. Sun has given Java the chance to truly flourish but in doing so has given up a little bit of control and a little bit of the ownership. From time to time others will play a role in advancing Java as the Fedora team and Red Hat did over the last year; and they&#8217;ll rightfully take the credit for doing so. That&#8217;s a consequence of opening Java. On the whole I was pleased with Sun&#8217;s reaction &#8211; many Sun people involved in Java actively promoted the IcedTea milestone, recognizing it as progress for the Java platform as well. It could have been different &#8211; after all Sun and Red Hat are also competitors. I think if Sun continues to encourage others to promote and advance Java &#8211; all will be good.</p>
<p>OK, let me address some of the questions and misconceptions :</p>
<p><em><strong>Wow &#8211; a second Java implementation &#8211; this one is free and open source &#8211; way to go.</strong></em></p>
<p>Actually there have always been many Java implementations &#8211; eg. Sun, BEA, IBM, Azul, HP even Microsoft had one at one point (<a href="http://www.informationweek.com/news/software/development/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=18700571">but that&#8217;s another story</a>). And they were always free ($0) and as of a year ago Sun&#8217;s was also Open Source. Java is a pretty open specification &#8211; you have always been able to become a licensee and implement your own Java. But that is a <em><strong>huge amount</strong></em> of work.</p>
<p><em><strong>Who cares &#8211; Java is slow.</strong></em></p>
<p>Too funny. But much funnier back in 1999 when it was also partially true.</p>
<p><em><strong>OK, but this one&#8217;s going to be slow</strong></em></p>
<p>The OpenJDK in Fedora 9 is largely (ie. 96%-99%) based on Sun&#8217;s JDK 1.6 &#8211; so it&#8217;s likely to perform about the same.</p>
<p><em><strong>I&#8217;m worried about fragmentation &#8211; now anyone can have their own Java-like distro.<br />
</strong></em></p>
<p>Firstly, Given the momentum behind Java &#8211; producing something that is partially Java isn&#8217;t going to be particularly interesting. Sun still protects the Java brand &#8211; if it&#8217;s called Java, it must behave like Java (ie. minimally pass the Java TCK). I still can&#8217;t imagine why anyone (ie. other Linux distros) wouldn&#8217;t just take openJDK and IceTea as their imlementation of Java.</p>
<p><em><strong>Sun Open Sourced Java a year ago &#8211; there&#8217;s no news here</strong></em></p>
<p>The initial OpenJDK had encumberences which meant it could not be distrubted fully in some of the more important Linux distributions like Fedora. Now it can. That is significant &#8211; we have not seen the true potetnial of Java on Linux. Now we have an implementation <a href="http://www.opensource.org/node/344"><em>everyone</em> can feel good about</a> -  we will.</p>
<p><em><strong>OpenJDK has been distributed with &lt;your favourite linux&gt; since April.</strong></em></p>
<p>Sure &#8211; but it likely had the &#8216;encumberances&#8217; &#8211; while that may be an OK situation for many &#8211; it wasn&#8217;t an OK situation for <em>everyone</em>.</p>
<p><strong><em>But my XYZ app doesn&#8217;t run on this jdk</em></strong></p>
<p>Sun&#8217;s TCK can&#8217;t guarantee that every possible current and future app. will work &#8211; as I mentioned &#8211; passing the TCK is a milestone; not the end goal. If your app doesn&#8217;t run or behave as it should then help by filling a bug.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>The real news</title>
		<link>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/200</link>
		<comments>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/200#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 14:39:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>sharps</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[open source]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IcedTea]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[java]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[OpenJDK]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.softwhere.org/?p=200</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Of course the real news was that Red Hat (and many others) were even given the opportunity to be part of the evolution of Java. This was only possible because a bunch of people (like Simon Phipps), inside and outside of Sun had the clarity of vision, passion and determination to actually make it happen; [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course the real news was that Red Hat (and many others) were even given the <a href="http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/196">opportunity</a> to be part of the evolution of Java.</p>
<p>This was only possible because a bunch of people (like <a href="http://blogs.sun.com/webmink/entry/free_compatible_java_at_last">Simon Phipps</a>), inside and outside of Sun had the clarity of vision, passion and determination to actually make it happen; and in doing so increase the opportunity that Java represents for Sun and everyone else.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t underestimate what courage this took. If you&#8217;re in any doubt &#8211; go tell your CxO that <em>you</em> want to take one of your most valuable applications; open source it and let everyone in the world benefit from your investment and hard work. Best case &#8211; you&#8217;ll get put on a <em>medical leave of absence</em>.</p>
<p>Now we just need to work on the JCP <img src='http://blog.softwhere.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Firefox 3, Free and Open Java</title>
		<link>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/154</link>
		<comments>http://blog.softwhere.org/archives/154#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 May 2008 11:26:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>sharps</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Red Hat]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Technology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[open source]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Fedora]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Firefox]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[IcedTea]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[java]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[OpenJDK]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.softwhere.org/?p=154</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Last week I installed Fedora 9 on my laptop and so far I like what I see &#8211; the desktop and visual effects are pretty nice without being to much of a distraction. Security is pretty solid with encrypted disk and SE Linux if you need it. All in all &#8211; everything seems to hang [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Last week I installed <a href="http://fedoraproject.org/">Fedora 9</a> on my laptop and so far I like what I see &#8211; the desktop and visual effects are pretty nice without being to much of a distraction. Security is pretty solid with encrypted disk and SE Linux if you need it. All in all &#8211; everything seems to hang together. I&#8217;ve mainly used Ubuntu and OS/X over the last 4 years and this is the first time I&#8217;ve tried Fedora but everything seems pretty familiar. I&#8217;ve still got to iron out a few issues related to working with Red Hat&#8217;s IT infrastructure (how ironic is that) but all in all I think F9 is a keeper.</p>
<p>A couple of things stand out. First &#8211; the Fedora peeps took a little bit of a risk by including Firefox 3 (beta 5) but I think it paid off &#8211; Beta 5 seems pretty solid and Firefox just keeps getting better and better. There&#8217;s no specific feature of Firefox 3 I&#8217;m excited about but there a quite a few nice little touches that make a difference &#8211; eg. the ability to open all the bookmarks in a folder  &#8211; I can now open all my work related apps with one key click &#8211; nice.</p>
<p>The second thing of interest is the inclusion of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IcedTea">IcedTea</a> &#8211; this is a completely free and open version of Sun&#8217;s OpenJDK and was developed by Red Hat. I&#8217;m personally pretty excited about Red Hat&#8217;s involvement in OpenJDK &#8211; I think we&#8217;ll see Linux in general become a much more important place for the Java platform now that it&#8217;s part of the ecosystem.</p>
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